Complaints about Andrei Jikh and Theory11

Mark · 08-18-2011, 09:41 PM

I define cardistry the way it is today. It's just like the 'Cardini Change' which is nothing like Cardini's. Things tend to evolve in strange (almost magical) ways over time, so do those terms.

Also, 'XCM', as proud as De'vo and his Handlordz are of it, the term does NOT make sense. If there is one person in this world that does 'Xtreme Card Manipulation', it's Jeff McBride. Card manipulation to the extreme.

'Cardistry' on the other hand makes a lot more sense. Zack and the first publications put it as "the magical artistry of playing cards", true, but there is definitely no 'magic' in the word 'cardistry' so let it just be 'the artistry of playing cards'. It makes most sense of all terms.

On the De'vo topic, De'vo himself is probably the biggest manipulator in the world, not only for the flourishes but also for claiming them. He claims almost every single flourish out there and according to him, whatever his students came up with was actually created by him and stolen by them. I can only tell that De'vo himself is commonly the liar as for that. I don't know much about it in Andrei's case but I can only guess Andrei is just another victim.

And Theory11 is just bad. We've said it many times and we won't change our mind anytime soon. Their 'Death of the Double Undercut' is probably the most ridiculous of all. They cut the price after quite some people bought it and majorly complained about it (I believe T11 never sent a refund to any of them) and it still is "overpriced" for what you get.

It's not just Theory11 by the way, it's Ellusionist, it's The Blue Crown, it's Dan and Dave, it's Paper Crane Productions, even many independent artists, it's just the main magic industry today that's screwing it all up.

As for prices, I couldn't care less. Even if they would sell a 15-minute downloadable for $20, the art of magic still is way (if not too) open for the public these days. Then again, I'd rather have T11 sell $5 crap downloadables than I'd have anyone make a free, public tutorial for any trick. Cardistry is fine, there is no secret to that, and non-magical riddle/bar tricks would be approved by me too, but that's really about it.

But sure, Theory11 should stop lying to their customers! There is absolutely no reason for that other than hyping up things more than they have already been hyped. Telling the truth is not that difficult!

Albert · 08-18-2011, 11:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark

But sure, Theory11 should stop lying to their costumers! There is absolutely no reason for that other than hyping up things more than they have already been hyped. Telling the truth is not that difficult!

^OMG! First mistake found in Mark's forum posts! >.<

We all still love you though Mark

Mark · 08-19-2011, 03:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Albert

^OMG! First mistake found in Mark's forum posts! >.<

We all still love you though Mark

What? Didn't you know Theory11 has costum designers they lied to?

JK. Edited.

TheMisdirectingHand · 08-19-2011, 04:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark

What? Didn't you know Theory11 has costum designers they lied to?

JK. Edited.

HURRRRR.

All typos aside. This doesn't really look like it has much reason. They're discussing the definition of a long-used term. The terms have different meanings to different people. It's like asking, "What is the difference between a double lift and a double flip?"

Albert · 08-19-2011, 07:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark

What? Didn't you know Theory11 has costum designers they lied to?

JK. Edited.

LOL! Double fail

Seeing that this is an 'exposed' thread, the point of the matter is that the person or group being exposed are in the wrong. Not necessarily what term it being misused, but why this wrong use of the term led to a magician or group worth mentioning as bad.

There are satisfied people out there with Andrei Jikh's releases and Theory 11's releases, but that's not the issue here. The point is that Andrei got to where he was in a way that does not deserve the respect he is currently receiving from other young flourishers or magicians, who most likely has no clue about such an event, such as me.

Being satisfied with Theory11's products is all good and is to be expected from a company running a business. However, what is unethical is what kittydakat pointed out: they misinform their consumers on some of their products and so there are dissatisfied people as well, and for good reasons too; something that can be avoided through this thread.

In summary: Andrei Jikh is not as respectable as he is known to be and Theory11 has a tendency to over-exaggerate some of their products in a good way, when it simply is not.

End of story, no?

08-18-2011, 09:41 PM	#1
Mark Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 935	I define cardistry the way it is today. It's just like the 'Cardini Change' which is nothing like Cardini's. Things tend to evolve in strange (almost magical) ways over time, so do those terms. Also, 'XCM', as proud as De'vo and his Handlordz are of it, the term does NOT make sense. If there is one person in this world that does 'Xtreme Card Manipulation', it's Jeff McBride. Card manipulation to the extreme. 'Cardistry' on the other hand makes a lot more sense. Zack and the first publications put it as "the magical artistry of playing cards", true, but there is definitely no 'magic' in the word 'cardistry' so let it just be 'the artistry of playing cards'. It makes most sense of all terms. On the De'vo topic, De'vo himself is probably the biggest manipulator in the world, not only for the flourishes but also for claiming them. He claims almost every single flourish out there and according to him, whatever his students came up with was actually created by him and stolen by them. I can only tell that De'vo himself is commonly the liar as for that. I don't know much about it in Andrei's case but I can only guess Andrei is just another victim. And Theory11 is just bad. We've said it many times and we won't change our mind anytime soon. Their 'Death of the Double Undercut' is probably the most ridiculous of all. They cut the price after quite some people bought it and majorly complained about it (I believe T11 never sent a refund to any of them) and it still is "overpriced" for what you get. It's not just Theory11 by the way, it's Ellusionist, it's The Blue Crown, it's Dan and Dave, it's Paper Crane Productions, even many independent artists, it's just the main magic industry today that's screwing it all up. As for prices, I couldn't care less. Even if they would sell a 15-minute downloadable for $20, the art of magic still is way (if not too) open for the public these days. Then again, I'd rather have T11 sell $5 crap downloadables than I'd have anyone make a free, public tutorial for any trick. Cardistry is fine, there is no secret to that, and non-magical riddle/bar tricks would be approved by me too, but that's really about it. But sure, Theory11 should stop lying to their customers! There is absolutely no reason for that other than hyping up things more than they have already been hyped. Telling the truth is not that difficult!