Magic trouble

la0o9 · 04-29-2011, 03:38 PM

So... there's a guy at my school, he's new in magic and joins our school's unofficial magic club( it exists, but the teachers doesn't know about it), however, he's simply there for the little things that would from time to time be slipped up( like angle control, every time i or someone in the club is about to do a trick, he would go and stick his head, literally, at the most inconvenient angles that would needed to be hidden: my POV, my left, and sometimes below the deck), and meaninglessly say that i flashed( seriously, people WANT to hide those places while performing, there's no way he wouldn't see it).Since he's technically not a spec, audience control just doesn't work on him, he wouldn't practice a single thing seriously( one day he could be asking how to do a pass, the next he would ask how to do the erdnase change...), to make things worst, he's a year above mine.

What do i do with this guy? Should i just ignore him completely at club meetings or should i talk sense, in the cruelest way possible, into him?

TheMisdirectingHand · 04-29-2011, 04:03 PM

Explain to him how it is to practice like a magician, and the insecurities of angles of a magician. If he doesn't understand, he's simply there to learn effects without practicing them...

la0o9 · 04-29-2011, 05:58 PM

like i said, he's my senior, so i can't really lecture him like that. Also, that fact have been established for a while.

Albert · 04-29-2011, 09:41 PM

I'm assuming your culture has that common Asian seniority culture, seeing that you have to respect the seniors.

In that case, one option is to screw him the heck over using gaffs or gimmicks (or even dupes for example).

Second is to talk with the rest of the group members except him first to discuss how to figure something out. If there is at least one member who is as old or older than that "heckler" (in a sense), you can ask him to tell him off. If not, you've got to just stand up and say as politely as you can "you know what? What you are doing is completely rude and disrespectful. If you are not serious about magic, please leave. You aren't welcome here". Even if he doesn't go away, you've got to make him feel uncomfortable being there.

If you are afraid to do that because he's older, you still need to take your stance. I've been in similar situations and I've even confronted an adult about it a few years back (and my culture is pretty strict about seniority as well). As long as you are polite in the way you speak, there is no legitimate excuse for him to harass you.

You just have to stand up to him like a man. Get your group members to help if you can. Strength in numbers, as they say.

Travmang · 04-29-2011, 10:06 PM

And if that doesn't work, beat him up!

I'm only joking.

TheMisdirectingHand · 04-30-2011, 12:42 AM

Ohh, that's right... you're in Vietnam. My apologies. When people do that, I simply do not perform at all. Act nicely and respond casually when he asks why. It's what I do when people constantly harass my angles.

OR... take Albert's idea and screw him over.

Taking your stance is a great idea, just do not be too aggressive.

la0o9 · 04-30-2011, 01:18 AM

it's not really a matter of performing, but rather doing club activities, if we don't do something while we're at the club, we might as well not be there. Hmmmmm, may be i'll try that, taking a stance, asking another senior older than him is a no-go, since they're all too busy concentrating on studying for uni exams that is coming up in a month, so i'll very "politely" crush him with my words *smirk*.

@Albert: so you're saying that i should only do gaffed tricks so that he won't be able to find out? i srly hate gaffs and gimmicks, too bothersome to bring to school.

Kieran Oloughlin · 04-30-2011, 04:47 AM

SO la0o9 do you go to school or uni and what year are you?

As about that guy he just sounds intrested in how magic is done rather than from actually being able to do it. Set up some restricitons maybe say to join the club you need to be able to do this and this and if he is new then it will be something that he cant do. Or maybe do what albert said and speak to him about it also another suggestion do you have like a meeting place or something because if you do change it for a while and then go back to your original without telling but that depends on where your meeting and how often ect. You could talk to the teachers though, say you and your firends meet and discuss magic and this guy comes along and basically bullies you in a unique way (just an idea).

la0o9 · 04-30-2011, 07:52 AM

i'm finishing my 1st high school year( which is 10th grade here).

1st of all, and i can't seem to stress this enough, i'm just a member, not the president of the club or anyone important, so i'm in no position to make any sort of rules, i tried changing meeting place once... result was a few confiscated decks of cards( the law ban gambling here, holding a deck of cards in school suggests that we are gambling 90% of the time).

2nd, because of the reason above, coming to the teachers for help is like asking for your cards to be confiscated...thanks for trying anyways.

Albert · 04-30-2011, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by la0o9

hat i should only do gaffed tricks so that he won't be able to find out? i srly hate gaffs and gimmicks, too bothersome to bring to school.

Oh hell no! I meant that to screw him over specifically, you can use gaffed cards or gimmicks just for that purpose. Remember, a magician has to be ready to fool laymen (as he more so is than a magician) at a moment's notice.

Kieran Oloughlin · 05-01-2011, 04:41 AM

Ohh so thats why you cant tell the teachers that suck
I am in yr 10 too butr due to the diffrences in the way school is run in our countries I am not even half way through and have been on 2 week holidays that ends the day after tommorow (DAMN) and I will have another 10 week term and then I will be half way through. Sorry I thought you where an adult (hahaha)
Gambling is not band at our school but card games are in the libary which is where I would preferbly perfom as it has tables and it is clean.

If you have a president of the club speak to them if not do what you said berfore and crush him with your words. You could make a plan with evryone else and whenever someone is doing a trick and he starts being annyoing walk of in diffrnet directions or something or just stop there and say something like thats the trick and evereyone calps. (a bit of a wierd idea)

la0o9 · 05-01-2011, 04:46 AM

do i really sound like i'm old?

Kieran Oloughlin · 05-01-2011, 04:55 AM

Kind of the way you talk No offense intended

la0o9 · 05-01-2011, 05:41 PM

lol, no worries, i don't get offended that easily, unless you insult my intelligence, i don't really get angry or upset at all, i'm a very easy going guy

Kieran Oloughlin · 05-28-2011, 05:22 AM

Has the guy stopped being anyyoing yet?

la0o9 · 05-28-2011, 09:31 AM

no, but it's summer vacation so i'm free of him for a while.

Kieran Oloughlin · 06-01-2011, 10:12 AM

Maybe durrinf the summer break they will wise up and come back as a better magician with stuff to show off or he will quit magic. Either or.

---------- Post added at 05:42 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:30 PM ----------

Also my magic firend I think has kind of given up magic although he wont admit it. He spends all his time when he has cards in his hand practcing the anacond (he found a free online tutorial on youttube) The last trick he learnt was 6 weeks ago during the holidays and was an ACR. Now for people who pay for their magic and have been doing it for years (this does not include me) this may be normal but for a beggnier who learns all his magic from yt not so much. Today I was performing a trick with his deck, the biddle trick (I worked it out) after I cascaded the cards after shuffling he got annoyed because he likes it bent inot a postion that makes the anaconda easier and before I did the trick he aksed the name of it but I did not say but asked why he said so he could find a tutorial. I didnt say because he has already wathced several tutorials and not learnt the tricks (cardini change, snap change to name a few).
SOoooooooooo yeah what I just said seemed mor relivant before I typed it >_<.

Anyway I just want him to either learn more and learn what he looks up on yt rather than trying for a day and giving up or just admit he now longer does magic. I practice both flourishes and magic a lot not just one

04-29-2011, 03:38 PM	#1
la0o9 Move monkey atm Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Not where you'd want to go :P Posts: 747	Magic trouble So... there's a guy at my school, he's new in magic and joins our school's unofficial magic club( it exists, but the teachers doesn't know about it), however, he's simply there for the little things that would from time to time be slipped up( like angle control, every time i or someone in the club is about to do a trick, he would go and stick his head, literally, at the most inconvenient angles that would needed to be hidden: my POV, my left, and sometimes below the deck), and meaninglessly say that i flashed( seriously, people WANT to hide those places while performing, there's no way he wouldn't see it).Since he's technically not a spec, audience control just doesn't work on him, he wouldn't practice a single thing seriously( one day he could be asking how to do a pass, the next he would ask how to do the erdnase change...), to make things worst, he's a year above mine. What do i do with this guy? Should i just ignore him completely at club meetings or should i talk sense, in the cruelest way possible, into him? __________________ "Doubt isn't the same as saying people are bad, it simply means you actually care, 100% trust is nothing more than ignorance"~ Akiyama Shinichi- Liar Game "It's not the destination but the road to it that is worth the trip" "Be careful what you wish for... it might just come true"~ old saying "It's a small world, but only relatively" "Reality is not the world, it is the way humankind depicts the world, thus when you alter a person's way of seeing the world, you alter reality itself"

04-29-2011, 04:03 PM	#2
TheMisdirectingHand David Nguyen Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Rosemead, California Posts: 406	Explain to him how it is to practice like a magician, and the insecurities of angles of a magician. If he doesn't understand, he's simply there to learn effects without practicing them... __________________ "There are three types of people in this world; •People who talk and never do: The Lower Class •People who talk and do at the same time: The Middle Class •People who do before they ever talk: The Upper Class A real man does not need to talk. We are the upper class." -Joseph Lau

04-29-2011, 05:58 PM	#3
la0o9 Move monkey atm Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Not where you'd want to go :P Posts: 747	like i said, he's my senior, so i can't really lecture him like that. Also, that fact have been established for a while. __________________ "Doubt isn't the same as saying people are bad, it simply means you actually care, 100% trust is nothing more than ignorance"~ Akiyama Shinichi- Liar Game "It's not the destination but the road to it that is worth the trip" "Be careful what you wish for... it might just come true"~ old saying "It's a small world, but only relatively" "Reality is not the world, it is the way humankind depicts the world, thus when you alter a person's way of seeing the world, you alter reality itself"

04-29-2011, 09:41 PM	#4
Albert DarkSleightZ Artist Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Canada Posts: 671 Donor Score: 110	I'm assuming your culture has that common Asian seniority culture, seeing that you have to respect the seniors. In that case, one option is to screw him the heck over using gaffs or gimmicks (or even dupes for example). Second is to talk with the rest of the group members except him first to discuss how to figure something out. If there is at least one member who is as old or older than that "heckler" (in a sense), you can ask him to tell him off. If not, you've got to just stand up and say as politely as you can "you know what? What you are doing is completely rude and disrespectful. If you are not serious about magic, please leave. You aren't welcome here". Even if he doesn't go away, you've got to make him feel uncomfortable being there. If you are afraid to do that because he's older, you still need to take your stance. I've been in similar situations and I've even confronted an adult about it a few years back (and my culture is pretty strict about seniority as well). As long as you are polite in the way you speak, there is no legitimate excuse for him to harass you. You just have to stand up to him like a man. Get your group members to help if you can. Strength in numbers, as they say. __________________ "Bluffing is an important act to all strategies." - Lelouch Lamperouge

04-30-2011, 12:42 AM	#6
TheMisdirectingHand David Nguyen Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Rosemead, California Posts: 406	Ohh, that's right... you're in Vietnam. My apologies. When people do that, I simply do not perform at all. Act nicely and respond casually when he asks why. It's what I do when people constantly harass my angles. OR... take Albert's idea and screw him over. Taking your stance is a great idea, just do not be too aggressive. __________________ "There are three types of people in this world; •People who talk and never do: The Lower Class •People who talk and do at the same time: The Middle Class •People who do before they ever talk: The Upper Class A real man does not need to talk. We are the upper class." -Joseph Lau

04-29-2011, 10:06 PM	#5
Travmang Pharaoh of Magicianry Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Seattle, Washington Posts: 249 Donor Score: 50	And if that doesn't work, beat him up! I'm only joking.

04-30-2011, 01:18 AM	#7
la0o9 Move monkey atm Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Not where you'd want to go :P Posts: 747	it's not really a matter of performing, but rather doing club activities, if we don't do something while we're at the club, we might as well not be there. Hmmmmm, may be i'll try that, taking a stance, asking another senior older than him is a no-go, since they're all too busy concentrating on studying for uni exams that is coming up in a month, so i'll very "politely" crush him with my words smirk. @Albert: so you're saying that i should only do gaffed tricks so that he won't be able to find out? i srly hate gaffs and gimmicks, too bothersome to bring to school. __________________ "Doubt isn't the same as saying people are bad, it simply means you actually care, 100% trust is nothing more than ignorance"~ Akiyama Shinichi- Liar Game "It's not the destination but the road to it that is worth the trip" "Be careful what you wish for... it might just come true"~ old saying "It's a small world, but only relatively" "Reality is not the world, it is the way humankind depicts the world, thus when you alter a person's way of seeing the world, you alter reality itself"

04-30-2011, 04:47 AM	#8
Kieran Oloughlin Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Australia Posts: 414	SO la0o9 do you go to school or uni and what year are you? As about that guy he just sounds intrested in how magic is done rather than from actually being able to do it. Set up some restricitons maybe say to join the club you need to be able to do this and this and if he is new then it will be something that he cant do. Or maybe do what albert said and speak to him about it also another suggestion do you have like a meeting place or something because if you do change it for a while and then go back to your original without telling but that depends on where your meeting and how often ect. You could talk to the teachers though, say you and your firends meet and discuss magic and this guy comes along and basically bullies you in a unique way (just an idea).

04-30-2011, 07:52 AM	#9
la0o9 Move monkey atm Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Not where you'd want to go :P Posts: 747	i'm finishing my 1st high school year( which is 10th grade here). 1st of all, and i can't seem to stress this enough, i'm just a member, not the president of the club or anyone important, so i'm in no position to make any sort of rules, i tried changing meeting place once... result was a few confiscated decks of cards( the law ban gambling here, holding a deck of cards in school suggests that we are gambling 90% of the time). 2nd, because of the reason above, coming to the teachers for help is like asking for your cards to be confiscated...thanks for trying anyways. __________________ "Doubt isn't the same as saying people are bad, it simply means you actually care, 100% trust is nothing more than ignorance"~ Akiyama Shinichi- Liar Game "It's not the destination but the road to it that is worth the trip" "Be careful what you wish for... it might just come true"~ old saying "It's a small world, but only relatively" "Reality is not the world, it is the way humankind depicts the world, thus when you alter a person's way of seeing the world, you alter reality itself"

05-01-2011, 04:41 AM	#11
Kieran Oloughlin Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Australia Posts: 414	Ohh so thats why you cant tell the teachers that suck I am in yr 10 too butr due to the diffrences in the way school is run in our countries I am not even half way through and have been on 2 week holidays that ends the day after tommorow (DAMN) and I will have another 10 week term and then I will be half way through. Sorry I thought you where an adult (hahaha) Gambling is not band at our school but card games are in the libary which is where I would preferbly perfom as it has tables and it is clean. If you have a president of the club speak to them if not do what you said berfore and crush him with your words. You could make a plan with evryone else and whenever someone is doing a trick and he starts being annyoing walk of in diffrnet directions or something or just stop there and say something like thats the trick and evereyone calps. (a bit of a wierd idea)

05-01-2011, 04:46 AM	#12
la0o9 Move monkey atm Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Not where you'd want to go :P Posts: 747	do i really sound like i'm old? __________________ "Doubt isn't the same as saying people are bad, it simply means you actually care, 100% trust is nothing more than ignorance"~ Akiyama Shinichi- Liar Game "It's not the destination but the road to it that is worth the trip" "Be careful what you wish for... it might just come true"~ old saying "It's a small world, but only relatively" "Reality is not the world, it is the way humankind depicts the world, thus when you alter a person's way of seeing the world, you alter reality itself"

05-01-2011, 04:55 AM	#13
Kieran Oloughlin Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Australia Posts: 414	Kind of the way you talk No offense intended

05-01-2011, 05:41 PM	#14
la0o9 Move monkey atm Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Not where you'd want to go :P Posts: 747	lol, no worries, i don't get offended that easily, unless you insult my intelligence, i don't really get angry or upset at all, i'm a very easy going guy __________________ "Doubt isn't the same as saying people are bad, it simply means you actually care, 100% trust is nothing more than ignorance"~ Akiyama Shinichi- Liar Game "It's not the destination but the road to it that is worth the trip" "Be careful what you wish for... it might just come true"~ old saying "It's a small world, but only relatively" "Reality is not the world, it is the way humankind depicts the world, thus when you alter a person's way of seeing the world, you alter reality itself"

05-28-2011, 05:22 AM	#15
Kieran Oloughlin Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Australia Posts: 414	Has the guy stopped being anyyoing yet?

05-28-2011, 09:31 AM	#16
la0o9 Move monkey atm Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Not where you'd want to go :P Posts: 747	no, but it's summer vacation so i'm free of him for a while. __________________ "Doubt isn't the same as saying people are bad, it simply means you actually care, 100% trust is nothing more than ignorance"~ Akiyama Shinichi- Liar Game "It's not the destination but the road to it that is worth the trip" "Be careful what you wish for... it might just come true"~ old saying "It's a small world, but only relatively" "Reality is not the world, it is the way humankind depicts the world, thus when you alter a person's way of seeing the world, you alter reality itself"

06-01-2011, 10:12 AM	#17
Kieran Oloughlin Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Australia Posts: 414	Maybe durrinf the summer break they will wise up and come back as a better magician with stuff to show off or he will quit magic. Either or. ---------- Post added at 05:42 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:30 PM ---------- Also my magic firend I think has kind of given up magic although he wont admit it. He spends all his time when he has cards in his hand practcing the anacond (he found a free online tutorial on youttube) The last trick he learnt was 6 weeks ago during the holidays and was an ACR. Now for people who pay for their magic and have been doing it for years (this does not include me) this may be normal but for a beggnier who learns all his magic from yt not so much. Today I was performing a trick with his deck, the biddle trick (I worked it out) after I cascaded the cards after shuffling he got annoyed because he likes it bent inot a postion that makes the anaconda easier and before I did the trick he aksed the name of it but I did not say but asked why he said so he could find a tutorial. I didnt say because he has already wathced several tutorials and not learnt the tricks (cardini change, snap change to name a few). SOoooooooooo yeah what I just said seemed mor relivant before I typed it >_<. Anyway I just want him to either learn more and learn what he looks up on yt rather than trying for a day and giving up or just admit he now longer does magic. I practice both flourishes and magic a lot not just one